SUGGESTION: Funding Our Own Hard Network (Mesh?)

Shower thought suggestion here. Not completely thought out at all.

Would it be possible to allocate, collectively, centrally (or whatever) a small 1% fee of all Maidsafe coins (or transactions) to a non-profit organisation via a fund that is setup to buy, build and distribute global comms hardware for the SAFENetwork to use.

Communications hardware meaning fibre-optics, satellites, routers and then eventually even mobile phones, desktop computers.

Users can then sign up to this network for free. This can expand to mobile networks, telecommunications etc. The smart phones and computers would obviously need to be purchased with safecoins from the non-profit organisation and those funds would go back into building and maintaining the hard network.

Alternatively not all SAFENetwork users would have to pay this fee and only those who want to, therefore only they can then signup to the hardware network.

Maybe an idea to fund this Mesh Network I have read about?

Other threads I have found discussing something similar:


p.s. I have no idea when it comes to technology, so please be nice.


Oh no not more taxes… I’d totally agree if it was a voluntary subscription based campaign. And given the demand for internet you’d probably get a lot of people opting in but I still think it needs to be voluntary and not coercive.


Its the right idea! Somehow some way. I thought the ideal would be it being one of the ways to earn SAFE coin or more of it. Not just coin that spreads the network but also reinforces it by making it even SAFEer and makes it much more desirable. It also makes it economically more desirable because it would be cutting artificial scarcity cords, toll roads and gateways which has to be a huge accelerator.

I suppose this would mean a higher payout rate for certain verified bits of hardware? Seems like that could also present a real weakness to the SAFE economy as those keys might be manipulable but SAFE is something like a Net OS, and we still need SAFE software for the local units including local OS & SAFE browser. We also need compatible mesh hardware. With the right distributed computing approach and tech that might be adapted in some way like PC to get latency down it might be possible to replace the current internet primarily with meshed smart phones. On the face of it how do we replace data centers and super computers and transatlantic fiber trunk lines with these pocket units? Still its worth a try.

Curious that the conservative NRA might be a natural ally. Their guns are a lot better with com.
Nice if these pocket units were EMP, hardened, solar power powered, and built like a GSHOCK and designed to last decades. We want to limit the options of states, corporations and wealthy elites by making many things impractical for them or just plain out of reach, this also places a limit on the power of money. This takes away their nuclear options and cuts them down to size so we can work to get rid of arbitrary power and coercion. .

Remember that MaidSafe itself did some work with a Taiwanese or Chinese manufacturer but they’ve been kind of quiet on these lately. The three pieces together (net and local software layers plus end user owned mesh) form a loaded gun against the current system based on artificial arbitrary scarcity.

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The obvious reply that I expect would follow from those at the heart of MaidSafe, is that is not the way natural systems evolve or come into being.

Such an effort might be worthy but it’s distinct from what MaidSafe will achieve. It’s also funding without a clue of what’s involved; just because there’s a problem and Safe looks like easy picking, doesn’t make it a good use of resources.

Better to watch for opportunities to support and pile on those, funding an answer rather than randomly just because there is a problem. The answer might be cheap too, without any need to buy hardware. Leeching off MaidSafe isn’t the right approach but you could always appeal to Safe users - if you found an idea worth funding first.


Except that SAFE likely doesn’t succeed in its ultimate goal for long if at all without without a more solid hardware network. It will still be subject, not easily, but subject to manipulation from ISP and from NSA games involving attacking end user hardware. Its been said many times on here if you’ve got a key logger and a system that isn’t secure locally you’re out of luck.

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How about a model like what @Warren is hinting at where we use the same or similar mechanism as the incentive based farming model only with other hardware and tech?


There’s always someone with the next bright idea about how to spend other people’s money. Above are two different problems and I see no grounds for leeching off MaidSafe resources to solve the new one. Appeal to the users for donations, if you want but I can’t see that one problem necessarily affects the other. The world is not perfect, let’s solve one problem at a time. Put MaidSafe resources to solving the one clear problem that it is setup to resolve.

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There is at least one project that does this already: - Freifunk steht fĂĽr freie Kommunikation in digitalen Datennetzen

As soon as Testnet3 is up and running and I’m familiar with the inner workings a bit more, I’ll get in contact with the local community and see if it’s possible to combine the two.


Great find @hillbicks!

SAFENetwork is about solving lots of problems in order to create sea change overall, and I agree that there’s little point building SAFENetwork software while leaving the hardware as it is. This goes for devices as well as communications infrastructure. Same for the operating system, IoT the list goes on…

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Anything like FreedomBox?

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And any way we can encourage the randomized passing around and sharing donating with out receipt of raspberry pi type blind hardware linked to open anonymous SAFE account- would help. Same for memory sticks and open blind community SAFE terminals. Same aid to expression as cash, pre paid phones and unfotunately unregistered guns.

I followed development fo Freedombox for a long time, waiting anxiously. It is still a great idea, but the SAFE network should accomplish pretty much everything Freedombox hopes to and more, and better.

Securing computer hardware from having spyware built in is hugely important, and Freedombox wouldn’t handle that.

I like that, if each node is rewarded by passing data around then there’s a incentive to run such a node. Just like on Safe, you could then use that reward to make your data travel around the network paying each node it must go through until it reaches it’s destination.

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This reminds me the Catalan network. It started as a local project and now has around 30000 working nodes and growing internationally.

You don’t have to pay anything, well you have to pay your own antennas and stuff, but it’s mainly a collaborative project so everybody is free to join the network. They even have deployed fiber-optic in rural areas and local autorities allow them to use public telecom infraestructure to reach big cities like Barcelona.

A small report of a German TV about (you can activate the english subtitles :blush: )

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I am involved with the FreedomBox project.

@asdf: No, FreedomBox is mainly a server where Freifunk is mainly a router.

@fergish: No, while SAFE network provide crucial parts not in FreedomBox, it is not “everything” nor “better”: SAFE network is libraries and applications for running services and applications - it needs an underlying operating system.

FreedomBox is a server operating system targeted non-technical users.
As such, FreedomBox complements the server-side of SAFE network as (some or all, as the user chooses) the services served on that operating system.

Running Maidsafe on FreedomBox is discussed at Getting maidsafe on the freedombox server and getting Maidsafe integrated as official part of Debian and FreedomBox is discussed at Maidsafe on a - #2 by draw (yeah, confusing topics chosen for those - I wish they could be adjusted)

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I had hopes that SAFE Network, FreedomBox, & Daowisp, would merge and form Devastator… but for liberty, of course.

I doubt it would be wise to govern these related parts under the same organization.

Feels healthy to me that each of these parts are governed by separate organizations each caring for raching their (sub)goals independently or interdependently as needed:

  • Routing e.g. with SAFE
  • Distribution of coherently integrated compenents e.g. with Debian
  • Distribution of routing e.g. with Freifunk
  • Distribution of turnkey boxes for self-hosting e.g. with FreedomBox

No doubt when these various parts mature, then some (same or other) organizations will emerge to care for the integration of those various parts - possibly including delivery to your doorstep and fusing the chips needed for processing, etc.


Agreed. I miswrote. I should have said, I look forward to being able to use these great projects together.

Let’s discuss FreedomBox at Getting maidsafe on the freedombox server (and only there).