I wonder the same. Market makers? Bot trading algos? There have to be tactics. If that is how the game is played, I think it’s important to compete. Price draws at least some decent level of adoption but most importantly it supports a market and incentives.
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You could have a tiny number not accepting but the more which refuse to accept the token offered, the more uploads will fail for users trying to pay with that token.
As long as there’s a mechanism for people to bridge / exchange 1 Native ANT for 1 ERC20 ANT & vice versa, the values will stay close due to arbitrage. Just look at how 1 wrapped ETH = 1 ETH in value, and 1 wrapped BTC = 1 BTC. It’s very common and works - not because someone says so, but because the ‘wrapped’ asset can be redeemed for the real thing relatively easily.
If only a 1-way bridge that allows ERC20 to Native but not vice-versa is implemented, the transition may not be as seamless.
The nodes would earn in both, then node operators would be able to exchange one for the other if they prefer holding only ETC20 or Native.
If nodes only have 1 price that can be paid in either ETC20 ANT or Native ANT, they wouldn’t need to do anything… but them being willing to accept this would require some kind of bridging mechanism to be in place and functioning well.
I’m just putting forward some plausible and pretty obvious conceptual solutions… who knows how the team will actually do it, but I’m looking forward to finding out in due course (and do hope it involves a full 2-way bridging mechanism).
To me it’s similar to a hardfork in BTC which are rare but have worked too. Or am I missing something?
I generally agree that the communication and reasoning around the native token was / is bad. They keep telling the main reason against a native token was the issue with exchanges although I think the nain reasons are technical (e.g. no stable network).
If the payment can be made to go to the next node willing to store and accept payment in Native ANT, missing out on fees could be a good incentive for nodes to accept both versions of the token.
Solana thrived by attracting memecoins onto their network. Anytime you are buying/swapping one of those memecoins you needed SOL. Some video games are built on SOL so you need a small amount for certain transactions in game. This creates buying pressure for SOL as people need it for gas. Millions of people buying a few dollars every month worth of SOL creates a lot of volume.
Polygon/Matic created one of the first L2s, a way to run parallel to ETH while solving high gas fees and scaling issues. Their native token is used for gas. They became mainstream in 2020 when the NFT craze was going around, when gas could cost $100s of dollars for simple transactions. They were in the right place at the right time. I personally use this for cheap USDC transfers.
Then of course their is Bitcoin, Ethereum, Dogecoin, LTC, XRP. They were some of the first cryptos when we didn’t have the big CEXs we have now. By the time big CEXs entered these coins already had very high mcaps and volume, so of course they were supported.
Then many exchanges have their own native token, and of course they will support their own token. Examples include OKB token for OKX, Cronos for Crypto.com, Gate Token for Gate.io, KuCoin Token for KuCoin, and so on.
Uniswap and PancakeSwap tokens get listings as the coins have a lot of volume do to various incentives you have to hold them. They generally have vey high APY for staking and benefits/multipliers for people providing liquidity. When Defi products became hot these blew up. This is what we need to do. Create a product/network that millions of people are using. If people are using Autonomi to upload and download data, and interacting with various apps, that will create demand for the ANT token. Now people need to buy it, creating volume. 
Now that we have millions and millions in volume, CEXs will consider accepting a new technology. Its easier for a SOL or ETH token to get listed then a native because the CEX understand the technology and have done it for a bunch of similar tokens.
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You’re describing a stablecoin which is not a practical solution to this because I don’t think it is achievable.
If you can achieve that, there’s a possibility of getting nodes to accept both but you would have to see the details to assess if it would be acceptable to people. Plus, it doesn’t get you from one to the other, so we remain wedded to blockchain unless somehow, using a dual currency approach suddenly becomes a driver to move completely off one token to the other.
Not impossible, but not credible IMO.
Again, not impossible, but not credible IMO. It has worked a few times, mostly created backwater coins, is not a credible argument that this is going to lead us back to the fundamentals.
I think happybeing is generally stuck in his own thoughts of how this network should or should not be build or function. It does not matter what token, coin or crypto is used to pay for storage. Autonomi nodes will be chain agnostic as soon as a few developers start making efforts to build dapps.
Also, it is highly unlikely autonomi will ever have its own native currency, looking at how tech such as sol or sui have solved payment and are sufficiently decentralized. Or perhaps you want POW, go with KAS. This network is designed for data, not for payments. You seriously want this team to spend another 5 to 10 years creating another type of blockchain? DAGS do not work for payments, howmany examples do you need of failed technology past 20 years? Remember IOTA? You cannot propagate payments though nodes using DAG sufficiently. And even if you solve for double spend, blockchain is so fast and even private nowadays it be a waste of resources to come up with something new.
I understand your vision but its already there. Give it a year and things will work out and become more user friendly.
We want autonomi to be chain agnostic, think it through.
(This does not exclude a currency such as ANT, which can still grow in value along network growth)
Conceptually, it’s absolutely a credible solution, given many projects are doing it all the time and it works to keep 2 versions of an asset at the same value.
Whether it’s technically viable to have a 2-way bridge between an Autonomi native asset and ERC20 token on Arbitrum, I can’t say, but I hope it is.
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It does matter for more reasons. Not a dealbreaker, but it can help or hinder spreading of the network and onboarding users.
We need native currency because none of the available cryptos have the performace we would like to have for Autonomi network.
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May i ask what performance you are refering to?
Transaction speed has already been solved
Privacy has already been solved, just not as user friendly as it can be.
There is no perfect currency, and i doubt autonomi can design one that beats em all
- number of transactions per second
- transaction speed
- cost per transaction
Not a problem now or for next year or two, but imagine real success of the network and billion of users. That will need HUGE number of transactions per second and I doubt any current crypto is capable of that.
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What you are refering to is solana (and its roadmap). It does close to 90% of all current blockchain transactions. Why? It’s fast and cheap. I am scalping memecoins all day everyday for pennies on the one second timeframe, onchain. Can you believe it?
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There is one big advantage in native crypto; in Autonomi network you only need one copy of the blockchain.
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Hmmm… but why not store the complete Bitcoin (or any other crypto) blockchain to the Autonomi network? It opens quite interesting possibilities. Well, I guess it is going to happen… just wait for it.
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The goal of the native token is (was) to be completely free transactions and no blockchain, aka, completely private.
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Well, we already need Native ASAP… I just uploaded a small file and the gas fee (ETH) was worth $0.047… massively more than what I paid to nodes in ANT (though that’s tiny now as the network is empty).
I would like to know what portion of the time taken for the upload was waiting for the Arbitrum transactions to complete. I wouldn’t be surprised if it slowed down the process noticably.
Until we have native, transaction fees are basically a tax on every upload to Autonomi… money that would be better off going to nodes.
A native autonomi token would absolutely beat everything out there at the moment in terms of speed, cost, and probably privacy & decentralisation. So, bring on native I say 
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Can we convince you to have only native now and leave blockchain were it belongs on the old internet 
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I want both 
Native only would be great if it were ready, tradeable, and able to be secured in a way that is guaranteed to survive a network failure and re-start (though of course I’m hopeful that won’t be needed).
But, as it is, native isn’t ready, wouldn’t be tradeable, and may not be able to survive a network failure & restart.
So I think getting going with Arbitrum makes sense, as does developing Native ASAP
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Totally agree but when native is ready erc20 has to go 
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