Because of this problem, I predict that MAID will be at times more expensive than SafeCoin. Because the farmed SafeCoin will not be traded on the exchanges…
Why would the redeeming of safecoin for their MAID go through exchanges. This is totally not needed. The fact is that it is easy to do the issuance of safecoin from a person’s MAID.
They use say omniwallet.org and send the MAID to a specified address and the issuance occurs from there.
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I say that people will not exchange MAID for SafeCoin at all (obviously not all people. Some will exchange it) and the exchanges will continue to trade in OMNI MAID and not in SafeCoin…
Of course there will be decentralized exchanges. But companies that want to run services on the SAFE Network and need SafeCoin will have to buy MAID (and not SafeCoin) from a centralized exchanges…
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Not saying it’s not the best solution I’ve heard so far, but, I think that could cause problems with peoples faith in wanting to buy safecoin.
I would not want to buy coins, given that if the network failed, they could be returned to the original owner leaving me out of pocket.
It could also encourage large current holders to sell all after conversion and collude to attack the network.
Edit. I think this topic probably needs it’s own thread, I imagine there will be much debate to find an acceptable option.
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Do not underestimate the significance of this issue. The need for exchanges to be able to maintain privacy will continue to be squeezed by global powers. I do not know how this will play out for SafeCoin, Monero and the like
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unfortunately, yes … If it’s a big percentage of your MAID write me to help you, komşu…
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Interesting example @Dimitar from the Omni(Mastercoin) fork Counterparty. Also illustrative of the amount of exchanges and liquidity levels available to ERC-20 markets for tokens.
Two way conversion sounds like unnecessary complexity right now. The script to convert X to Safecoin would just need to accept the amount to be converted, and that amount could come equally easily from the Omni burn or SafeCoin(ERC-20) burn script. I do agree that later on a two way conversion would be useful but between SafeCoin(ERC-20) and Safecoin to create a bridge between two active communities allowing investors and developers to cross and build cross chain services with minimal friction.
This is a fairly strong statement to make right out the gate. If we take just the community poll numbers at face value the majority of just active forum readers appear to be expressing interest in participating in Safecoin(ERC-20) markets. How much that translates to actual demand (from just existing forum members) is hard to quantity. Some of us are unable/unwilling to participate in existing two Omni exchanges for the red flags raised previously and in the very limited cases I personally know of it is not an insignificant amount of monthly income streams/xmas bonuses that will be now cut off from MAID. We will have a better idea of the bigger picture in a few months I am sure.
Complexity wise there are a few older mostly pre-Ethereum projects that transitioned to ERC-20 token (many more have jumped from ERC-20 to Tron and EOS) without apparent user confusion so I am not sure why you think it would be different in our case? Your initiative to study similar transitions like @Dimitar StorJ example is really great. It might also be very useful to quantify the range of exchange service options available to the similar caliber projects at least from an active development yardstick. Here is a list of potential ERC-20 projects ranked by development every month. Just eyeballing the number of exchanges available to trade over on coinmarketcap I would guesstimate an average of 5 exchanges for actively developed projects. I may have a biased opinion but the Safe Network project has way more potential and is of a higher caliber than most of those projects and yet is seriously lagging on the exchange front. The Omni effect.
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What do they pay in tax on these sales though?
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Because the money is paid in salaries then no tax otherwise it becomes double dipping.
The income becomes a legit business expense
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My personal opinions and assesments here, not the company’s.
I agree with you @krnelson, I do not see the basis for the claim.
I’ve created a test ERC20-token and that is easy (already mentioned by many here).
The site to collect people’s burn addresses exists under MIT (thanks to PDC) and can be reused.
This site is very simple and straightforward.
The main work is repetitive and ongoing manual transfers, which is not complex, just repetitive.
Additional work is the added “customer support” as people will ask more questions about this and ask for updates in the transfer etc.etc.
There are manual handling risks, like that people will not manage the burn properly, or in the continuous payout of new tokens.
But there is no time constraint, so it is a very low risk, since everyone will take their time to get it right.
I am, again personally, 100% positive to ERC20 extension as one of the tools in the toolbox, because I see it simple enough to do and having many known and unknown benefits, of which the known alone weigh up the costs, in my assessment. I.e. cost/benefit looks positive to me.
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Some of this support work can be done by the community. If the forum is referred to as a support channel.
Transformation of the coins can be once a week, so that people can have 1 week to object if they have given the wrong ethereum address for the new coins (for example, if they specified an ethereum address on exchange…)
Also, the transfer of new coins can be done by selected people in the community with Multi-Signature Wallet, so the burden on the company will be 0…
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Why calling it “Attacking the project”? I would rather call it “healthy criticism” and I see nothing wrong with that. Is this a Democracy, or social communism environment here, where you are not allowed to express any discontent with the way things are? I don’t get it why people here are so protective regarding this project? Seriously you should thank those people who ask the “management” tough questions that you don’t have the guts to ask.
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Please make a distinction between a question and a statement. He is obviously making a FUD statement, not asking a question, is he?
I agree, but people here are over reacting to “fud”. It exists in every project and every channel. The reaction to what you call “fud” looks worse than the “fud” itself. I’m telling you this as an observer that is visiting other communities. to be too serious is not so good, you people should have some self humor. If someone says something like this guy has just said it might mean he was just being concerned that it might take years away. It was definitely good that @happybeing reacted, but it wasn’t evident that he was “happybeing” when had answered this guy 
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I understand that it may look like this to you if you are not familiar with the background.
If you have to know this is not the first such statement of ZeroFlaw and it is normal to accumulate a negative reaction under constant pressure from his side…
Personally don’t think switching to the eth chain is worth the time and money. Don’t want to have to own any eth just so i can send my maid over. In my opinion eth is a bloathed chain with a myriad of poor projects. Don’t think the future holds anything for it. Heck didn’t vitalik sold 100 million worth of eth at all time high? There was a rumor another 25 million was sent on Christmas day by him too…
We need to get the network ready and release the safe token. Not go on a mid swap solution that is just going to burn time and resources.
Plus, other projects i know off like storj and oxy, didn’t get any benefits from moving there, if anything it killed their price …
Don’t think it’s an idea that should be chosen lightly.
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I agree, I didn’t give a strong basis for the claim, but likewise I have not seen any basis for the claim that erc20 is going to help. Apparently many projects have done the conversion… so… why is there (apparently) so much evidence available but so little being presented here?.. some little red flag in my mind goes up in this instance.
Good news that it’s not a complex process, just manual and repetitive.
Do you think the conversion of omni+erc20 to safecoin is simple, or does it incur complexity for maidsafe developers at conversion time?
Do you have links for verifying this claim? I’m interested in where to find sources of data for this so I can look further into it.
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Storj and oxy are two projects I followed. I probably lost 60k $ in oxy.
Storj moved over 2 years ago to the ETH chain. As for links you can probably check coin market cap for the price evolution. Oxy might be harder to find, they were a small project that figured going to eth would solve all their issues… It didn’t, they didn’t get listed on the big exchanges and the price went lower and lower until they abandoned the project.
Oxy is not really comparable to maid, it was bad idea, with a bad team. Storj is a great team, but, like most crypto, fell victims to the current market. It’s price is very similar to maid currently.
Not sure were to send you for direct links for these stories as I just followed these projects closely due to my investments. So most of these annoucements were on twitter or forum posts.
Hope it helps a little.
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For many exchanges adding another erc20 coin is trivial since they already have everything required set up, while adding something on omni is not. That means they need some extra incentive if they’re gonna add some omni coin, but MAID doesn’t have the necessary trading volume to give that incentive, so it’s not so likely that they’ll add it. Small exchanges like ChainRift will got the extra mile to add coins like MaidSafe, since they already struggle to reach any meaningful trading volume.
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That’s a sincere and candid response David.
I don’t believe you to be a scammer or fraud nor that you aren’t heavily invested in the success project. I think you have made a series of bad decisions with regards to business and project management over the years, in amongst a larger series of good decisions - this is no indictment and I’m in no greater position than anyone else to pass one. You get plenty of credit and support on this forum so for the sake of focus I kept my recent posts to the negative points I wanted to convey to the group as I believe them to be both pressing and important.
It sucks that you have taken an unexpected tax hit, and I’m really sorry to hear that. But HMRC gave pretty clear guidance back in 2014 about these rules so I can’t help but see this as another mismanagement. You aren’t the only one to fall foul of these rules and there are understandable reasons to do so (pressure of work being one) but with such a large decision the info was available to be found. (Our debate aside, if you are interested in a UK accountant with good crypto knowledge Adrian Markey in Northern Ireland is best I have found).
I’m occasionally accused of not contributing positively, I happen to think what I give is constructive criticism but that personal opinion aside: I took a trip to the Czech Republic at my own expense 3 years ago to talk to a board of a EUR 6bn private investment firm about crypto and I spoke only about Bitcoin and MaidSafe for 2 hours. We covered tech, markets, risk, reward, strategies, digital asset management and how and why they should be considering an investment in both of those projects. This was unpaid and they were just curious - I wasn’t saying they should take my word for it, I was saying they should research more and apply their usual investment criteria and manage any investment based on continuous due-diligence, volatility, diversification and so on. Like @Sotros25 I organised meetups and advocated within various relevant business to get free venue space. I advocated to CoinScrum in London to invite you and Nick down to refresh the London scene’s view of the project and based on that they were willing to waive their usual speaking fees. The Brighton meetup is spawned out of my relationship with Cryptonomy.
I justified my focus on you earlier as you being in a unique position of being paid and in control. You have countered that by pointing out you could make more doing other work. This is called opportunity cost and every other investor in MaidSafe has the same opportunity costs, your position is still uniquely powerful and remunerated within this project. That is fine, but it comes with responsibility which should always be accountable and I don’t apologise for attempting scrutiny and criticism despite your other acts of good decision making, creativity, hard work and sacrifice you have demonstrated over the years.
You are now focused on engineering, thats fantastic. I wish you had done so from the start but that easy for me to say in hindsight. If more capital comes your way please keep it as a war chest to eek out on engineering alone since you are evidently in a project of unknown unknowns. Please also keep engineering to the bare minimum of getting a network live with no more features than lack of SPOF nodes, encrypted message passing, redundant dynamic encrypted data retention and a reliable cryptocurrency. CLI based, open source, protocol only, maybe not even an implementation - just a detailed and solid single description would suffice in my view (the result of many iterations of test implementations).
I’d be surprised if you have any enemies, I’m not one, just some git in the forum that is preying your baby lives.
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