If u have some unknown info, then place u there for others, I start by this:
By Jim from discord:
There are teams already developing social networks that will operate on the safe network. But they will use significantly different business models than the highly algorithmically surveillance-based ad models that support the likes of facebook. And that’s by design. The network can’t know, nor learn about you from your browsing habits.
It’s built on privacy by design principles.
Could you do advertising on the Network? Sure. But it would be back to traditional billboard-style, or product placement advertising, rather than highly targeted attention economy, click-bait inducing, behavioural modification models that we experience at the moment.
And I think that will be a positive step toward a better Internet.
Sure, great for the user, not so great for vendors. To them it’ll be like going back to the non-personalized highway billboard sign ad that may or may not garner much passing interest. If the gossip has legs, like to hear that folks are already developing products that align to and are compatible with the coming Autonomi Tech.
This opens the door to people being able to create their own advertising lists though.
“Hey, I’m in the market for this stuff. XX, YY, ZZ. If you’re a company offering that, show me your deals”
Nothing drives me nuts more than searching, researching, laboring over what product to get when I want something. I finally decide and buy it. I continue to get ads for said products for 2 months. I Bought It Already!
I want to take it off my list, and move on to the next thing. I’m all for that type of advertising.
I’d like some expansion of this. In the distant past we’ve discussed how apps can be kept from spying, but mostly talking about web apps.
Currently there isn’t a browser on the menu, so for now we’re dealing only with native apps, and there’s not much that “the network” can do about them spying and phoning home just like any other app today. There are features that help protect users - eg it will be easier to know what you are running is what you think it is, but what the app can and can’t do is a different matter. I suspect there are ways to sandbox native apps, such as using WASM but you can’t really force apps to work in a particular way and it will be hard for users to know what apps are doing behind the scenes.
Autonomi could do a lot to protect users from website / web apps by delivering a privacy hardened browser, but anything else is back to trust at the moment.
So vague statements like that, while technically true - because the network doesn’t know anything about anyone - don’t mean much and are I think quite misleading.
I don’t know if it’s an accurate quote, so have tagged Jim in cases he wants to clarify or correct.
There isn’t an Autonomi browser so it’s not clear what you mean by this, so nobody can answer that.
I’ve said that if Autonomi did produce a privacy hardened browser, it would be possible to protect users from privacy violations by websites and web apps.
Hopefully that will come but talk for now can only be about native apps. Hopefully too, one of the apps still to be announced by Autonomi will be a browser.
Its imo obvious there would be autonomi browser… maybe just a little bit edited some opensource knowable browser but personally I am sure there will be.
Could the apparent lack of a browser and the lack of a “DNS” be for the same reason ?
I have the suspicion that these components that we all consider essential may be being worked on right now by teams outside the official Maidsafe/Autonomi orbit.
In previous iterations of SAFE (long ago) there was the talk of being able to limit writes to only your owned data. And then only private data if you want. The app then needs to specifically ask permission to write elsewhere (phone home), or for ordering items from a online shop. AND more importantly the app could not use https etc on the internet.
But now apps are open and can do all this internet communications while being an autonomi app. We need a wrapper that can block all internet traffic if the user wants, a basic firewall wrapper that is a lot easier to use than we typically see in a firewall. EG one that pops up and says your app wants to talk to xyz website/domain, do I allow it (can be phoning home to steal personal info)?
As you say the browser is important now since that is a potential wrapper to do all this.
Lack of DNS is because DNS is not a core protocol and is a app layer thingo. Maidsafe may or may not develop it. Its possible to have many implementations of DNS and the user can choose.
There is no hidden anything on this. Its simple the reason.
As is a browser, but for the network to succeed, both are crucial. Yes of course there can be many implementations of both, we need at least one of each ASAP
Whether its Maidsafe or not -and IIUC there are very good reasons why it shouldn’t be them, I think somebody is working on a browser and/or DNS - cos ones no good without the other and the core protocol is severely limited without both.
Correct, but I was just saying why Maidsafe is not doing it. Maybe one of the as of yet unnamed partners are going to do it along with the browser. Also want native apps to use it too. The original browser was written by a non Maidsafe person remember (at the time) and then improved upon.
Network adoption needs a network effect of lots of users joining in to make Autonomi function properly, Uber figured this out by kickstarting with Fraternity invites paying for local frat parties. Uber paid for the Frat party at the Uni. They were Greek Fraternity invites in fact, in US Colleges and Universities. Uber went city by city funding these Frat parties until they had the USA covered, Uber still does this to this day. Food for thought, non? It’s was barbeque lighter fluid of a small amount of Uber spend per frat party which lit up the giant Uber Network in the USA in just 9 months, the rest is history. That is the network effect we need for Autonomi.
It’s a true
ground up revolution, plus use the local print shop to print t-shirts for the frat party, fund both frat & sorority parties across Europe and America this time around , “Safe the Internet with Autonomi”, make sure there is a Music Player and Video Player working at the time of Launch and make install on WIN11 and MacOS super easy with super easy uploads. Set a Target too that is published to everyone in terms of total node counts every day so everyone sees the growth from their Autonomi GUI Client
How do we find out what the total node count is? I dont think we ever had a count of total nodes other than by folks self-reporting. - which is fine(ish)
The foundation could run an app on autonomi that accepts randomized
infrequent gossip of current active and connected node count from clients everywhere and rebroadcast the count periodically back to the client. Need a random number generator add to the client code, so statistically the frequency of updates is reasonably well distributed across the installed number of clients currently running nodes. Don’t have nodes running? then your client can’t broadcast to the Foundation App, or broadcast at all …, yadda yadda…
No one will know. This is part of the privacy, decentralisation of control. Even total stored on the network will be difficult since we don’t know the number of nodes.
To know the number of nodes is to be leaking information of some form.
Maybe, but really that has to in the node itself as many will be running nodes on machines that never have a client running. People will not like that, big brother and all that
EDIT: Meant to add that it is possible though to gain an insight into the total number of nodes, but not accurate.
You write an app to do some crawling of neighbouring nodes. Take a node then crawl the neighbouring nodes till you say have 1000 nodes (more the better) and then take the XOR range these cover and so simple maths to get a total number figure. Not accurate but in the ball park of actual number. Works because of the randomised nature of XOR address allocation
That’s great to hear someone is building a social network on it. It will be interesting to see. I hope they give you complete control of your own data.
I’ll be more excited to see an open source social network that doesn’t require any adverts.
If the gossip has legs, like to hear that folks are already developing products that align to and are compatible with the coming Autonomi Tech.
