Will it become a choice between no ads or having data sold? Can it be ad free? That is what I think most people who are rational and informed would need to trust the system. Also would want a percent of the sale of a user’s data to go to the end user. To me it seems reasonable that it would be more than half and preferably almost all of it. A few times people on here have quipped that ProjectSAFE can’t just be a better bridge to FaceBook. Could such a service be done as a pure open source non profit effort? I am hoping at some point that all data that FaceBook has taken gets deleted, but to make that happen PRISM and other programs would probably have to be shut. Some of these tracker systems might work to provide automatic shopping for both novelties and staples in conjunction with a firm like Amazon
Is anyone actually working on this project?
@Warren the aim is to have ads but these would not be in the visual periphery of the user (in the main UI) unless the user grants permission and establishes a relationship with the brand that has advertised. For example bring the brand into your main feed (such as fb news feed). This relationship can be taken to different levels and terminated if the user chooses. The advertising aspect would be contained in a separate feature of the application that allows the user to search and/or filter ads, choose the depth of relationship with the brand they can have with their digital persona or choose what personal data, if any, the brand/advertiser can access. So yes ad free if you want, user can still sell their data regardless, multiple times. Further details will be provided when I post the project in the forum soon.
In terms of user data sold, the users themselves take sale value, distributed equally amongst users who provided their de-personalised data, minus a small transaction fee, which will likely be 1-0.5% of transaction value.
It is unlikely that the data facebook stores on its users will be deleted unless there is some significant legislative framework that legally requires fb to do so. Intelligence and security agencies would not like this and I would assume they would have data mirrored in their data warehouses anyway such as the gigantic one in Utah, sheesh with their “nothing to hide, nothing to fear” arguments they want everything.
Also shopping cart integration is planned, with bitcoin payments being key means of exchange, along with micropayment for news content, entertainment, music, video, art, education etc. I hope to provide further context when I post up the project soon.
@whiteoutmashups I am working on it now, an adaption of a social micropayment app I was developing a few years ago that I mentioned in my last post.
Sounds dope!
How do you plan on facilitating Bitcoin on SAFEnet without a gateway to the current internet/blockchain?
-
I think every money making option would have to be opt in, not opt out.
-
You have to chose who you serve, either your end users or your suppliers are your customers. I don’t think it can be both. I think if you have ads, vice a product search where the customer was in complete control or something like automatic shopping, if you have ads you turn your customers into products which is generally fraudulent and part of the problem that is destroying society. Systems that productize end users or customers are really systems of collusion and always a conflict of interest. I also don’t think ads work in the periphery, they are just an annoyance and point out sponsored allegiance.
-
I don’t think sponsored news is ever appropriate, its how we end up with sponsored government and sponsored law. With honest un-sponsored search there is no point in pushing and probably no point in news. If we ever get working AI it presumably would also be good at filtering sponsored spin and noise.
Some bright 7 year old will probably get around to permanently nixing all of FBs data. I am hoping that efforts like ProjectSAFE bring transparency that makes the abuses evident to the public so we legislate and find technical solutions that get rid of the business first sponsored society nightmare.
.
-
It will be opt in. What I am proposing is ad free, unless of course you want to see ads, in which case you are the one in control and making the choices.
-
This is a tricky situation and exactly the problem I am attempting to solve. The inspiration for the app was partly due to me seeing the advertising based business model of our current internet being intrusive and ineffective in facilitating ethical advertising. Users need choice and control over when or if they let a brand into their personal digital space and on what terms. The user will have choice on whether they “productize” themselves as you put it. Their personal data and the content they produce in the digital space they frequent is their property, if the user chooses to monitize it, or productize themselves this should be their choice. It is a form of Vendor Relationship Management as opposed to Customer Relationship Management
-
The content delivery side I would leave up to other developers and integration with the platform I am planning would need to fit the user privacy and choice based model. I agree that learning algorithms need to be developed to filter out spin and unwanted noise. AI would do they trick but we have to wait for that. I dont think you can fully eliminate PR and advertising so long as people create products and services and people want to buy those products or services. You just need to create tools for users to filter out the unwanted spin in the digital spaces in which they consume culture.
As for FB, the attrition has already started. They will fade. Whatever happens with the former user data will depend on what personal data rights evolve over the next few years. There is lots happening in this field but it will be the battle between privacy and compliance. I think the frameworks being developed now lean more towards compliance and mass surveillance acceptance than allowing privacy and freedom of choice, ID3 Open Mustard Seed being one of them.
App is still in planning stage and that problem is yet to be solved. Have a bitcoin developer I am getting onboard in the next month so that will be key. At this stage I know I will need to build a wallet system into the app or work with 3rd party wallet providers to come onboard. I am not a developer and havent fully immersed myself in the MaidSafe documentation enough to understand the technical side of that problem. Do you have any insight to offer? How would a bitcoin wallet operate on maidsafe?
I think a lot can be gained from simply developing a relationship with people and asking them their preferences as long as they know that data will be used in a way that completely serves their interests and is opaque with regard to dissemination of personal info.
With regard to push in product advertisement. I think its obsolete. We don’t need the impulse buy anymore. That impulse buy stuff has a real downward spiral on successive cycles of purchasing power and quality of life and even having healthy buyers to sustain markets. When people are in the mood having honest un-sponsored ad free search to match buyers and sellers could be a real advantage for both buyers and seller. For buyers it helps create a level playing field and can lead to higher quality products potentially more based on relationship or actual customer needs and wants vice the inflation that a marketing middleman would insert to serve their own needs. This may be relying on honest trending to an extent and word of mouth or possibly in some cases firms giving away product to sample to drive word of mouth. But as above it respects peoples time, and the value of their attention and the need to be free of interruption to avoid associated opportunity costs and costs in terms of stress. No more A pays B to exploit C where C has no recourse or recompense and may even be conditioned to the point of addiction to the process starting in childhood.
The way I understand it, SAFEcoin will be the only currency on the SAFEnetwork for quite some time. It is said there will be exchanges for SAFEcoin to fiat and other cryptos, but again I’m not sure how those get to interface to the ‘outside’ either.
So I guess you would be utilizing an exchange if dealing with Bitcoin
Why? Why can’t they be both? What if they’re one in the same? What if your end users ARE your suppliers? I think one of the major problems with our society is the means of production has been wrested from end user control and needs to be returned to end user control. This is largely what decentralization is about. So if an end user is producing content then of course they will be a supplier and an end user at the same time.
This just makes me think of a different application for all that big data that was discussed earlier in the thread. Instead of selling it to an advertiser put it into a database. Then use it to refer possible products, businesses and organizations the customer may like. These organizations need not ever have any kind of access to the user’s information or even know the user exists until the user chooses to interact with them in some way as all of this is client side and/or within the user’s safe network data. But if the user spends half his time looking up cars, it’s a safe bet to assume he likes cars, so the system sends him sites and recomendations on cars. If he finds a brand or style he likes he can vote that up and he gets more of that, if he doesn’t like it he can vote it down and gets less. You could even create an advanced voting system that measures what qualities were being measured and considered, one where qualities could be added and edited by the user. And basically taking all this data one can easily find exactly what one wants the way one wants. Various organizations submit their sites to the database but all have equal chances since everyone is different and the database itself doesn’t have any over arching rules or parameters, it’s all end user controled. Each user controls the preferences for what they receive in their advertising feed. And it’s not just advertising, it’s products of all kinds, it’s non profit organizations, it’s everything. This means that you use the service not just at random but every time you want to go shopping or are looking for some random person or organization. Also let the user have the ability to turn off all such filters and such so they have no “preferences” on at all. That way they can temporarly set the system back to default as if they were new users, in case it gets too biased towards a particular viewpoint. Say you were researching cars again and then lost your liscence or for whatever reason gave up driving: cars would no longer be relevent or as relevant. So you’d want to be able reset or disable that preference.
I agree and I think that is where we need to go. But as to formal old style suppliers I see sides taken and going in the wrong direction as you point out.
And as to the rest you know I agree with that. Its level playing field search that aligns the interests of buyers and sellers instead of pitting them against each other as Madison Ave does, it means better quality products and better value and better buyer seller relations.
Why not an app where you can read all your social stuff in one place. 
read your FBook, g+ and everything that you want. also be able to make a post and choose on what media you’ll post. should be possible with an extension for each medium (fb ext. 4 example). On the same hand you coul’d also make a post (or read stuff) within the Maidsafe social-network. Big advantage = people can make a soft switch to maidsafe AND the social app is still able to contact with the ‘old web’ so you can post, for example, on your own blog or forum.
So kind of like Friendica for Maidsafe?
Uh dude that brings me to a microsoft login prompt.
Yeah me too.
I’m not down for that
Hey guys,
We’re building a completely decentralized and distributed social network: Synereo.
I think many of you who’ve participated in this discussion will find what we’re doing very interesting.
I am the co-founder and CEO. I’m also a MaidSafe IPO investor. I’ve been looking at MS develop for many months now and we are indeed considering using it as our distributed storage solution.
Cheers
Hi all. I’m still really interested in doing this but have had to work on other things instead over the past months. I know the idea is that apps will earn safecoin for contributing value to the network, and I think that’s great, but in order to dedicate time and resources to this it’d be very helpful to have funding up front. I’ve been keeping an eye on e.g. the Gems crowd sale, and that’s been very successful so far. Is there any reason we can’t do some kind of crowd sale to “kick start” development of this? If it’s not a good idea, why not? If you think it’s a good idea, please share what method you think is best. Here are the ones I’m thinking of:
Kickstarter or similar