It isn’t as clear cut as that.
This is a business with investors, so they almost certainly mean “permissive” rather than “Copyleft” open source, which is an improvement over closed because the code can be audited and re-used.
However, it is still compatible with bait and switch, so unless we want that we need to set the bar higher (at AGPL or GPL).
I can understand the frustration of the partnership not being a fully open source solution. Great to hear it will become open source over time… Although it only sounds like the client side.
For me this is fine. We want to see things built on the network. Yes we all want to see open source grow on Autonomi, but it is an open network and a free market. You can’t stop companies building on the network, but you can build, promote, and decide to use what you want.
Even if this password manager never open sources their code it will surely help the networks development and prove the capabilities… bringing more app developers.
If you want it, build it.
JAMS plans on the same strategy. Close sourced till we get our footing, then open to all! We share the same ideals, it’s just about ensuring some level of longevity and or ROI.
Just to clarify that the concern is not that a private business will use the network, but that the Foundation will pay for it.
I assume we are all aware that the value of the Foundation tokens comes from the community and it is not moral to use them to reduce the costs of a private business…
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Please do test it! We need beta testers right away! Currently you can test on chrome, brave, (opera and edge work but they are still not fully tested for UX), and iphone. Android is being worked on as I type with a goal of releasing it before the holidays.
Ah ok. I didn’t realise that.
I agree, foundation money should only be funding open source projects.
I couldn’t know how it was intended.
It said explicitly Autonomi community is wondering. Not I am wondering, or some people on the Autonomi forum is wondering.
Yes that was my mistake and I deleted it. Unfortunately, some expressions don’t immediately come to me in English, I’ll keep that in mind in the future. Thanks for pointing out my mistake.
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No problem, very understandable mistake.
That’s very good of you to respond to some of the concerns here, I appreciate it. I look forward to seeing where the partnership with Autonomi goes, and wish you the best with it all.
I would echo the point about the GPL - ethical points aside, the idea that closed source means more income and therefore is attractive to investors, might not necessarily be grounded in reality. Here’s a recent piece from an industry analysis company going into detail Software Licensing Changes and Their Impact on Financial Outcomes – Alt + E S V
Holding off on GPL (or similar) might make sense in some cases, though, sure. The last point I’d make is that it’s not about price at all - you can charge for it if you wish. One approach I feel I see more of is copylefting the code, and putting a big shiny “pay this fixed amount if you want to support this project” button there as an option. There’s also the idea of providing consulting work as experts with the software, which seems to work for some companies as well.
Whatever route you go, I think copyleft gives a very strong and compelling message: “We want to be a part of the future, where software is shared and communities start to really flourish.”
Thanks for this. We know there are a lot of directions a company can go to open source. Our goal with KryptPass is that the client remains open sourced because if people want to trust us to self-custody their passwords, they should be able to know how that is working. There is, of course, freemium services that companies can build on top of their open source, which is a way to generate revenue for continued development. As a company who has a business in code audits where we earn the bulk of our money, and API services that larger enterprises can license, we felt confident in releasing a free base product for consumer use & confident in open sourcing because it is not our sole revenue source, so it does not have to have the same pressure. (Also, with our P2P set up we have very low operating costs).
I feel there may be an actual misunderstanding here - what is the “it” you are referring to? At no stage did I speak on behalf of anyone but myself. Unless I’m missing something, but I reread my messages, and I simply do not think it’s possible to read anything I said as suggesting I’m speaking on behalf of anyone but myself. Is there an English language confusion, or some post is being attributed to me that I didn’t make?
Please, point me to the thing you’re referring to where I say that the “Autonomi community is wondering”, or stop saying made up things which I’ve already responded to?
To be clear, I’m not saying “people should have read my mind and known my intentions.” I’m saying that I made it clear repeatedly that I was representing my own views, and anyone suggesting I was doing something different is twisting the facts.
You don’t say so. Dimitar said so in the tweet quoted in one of his posts above:
So, a misunderstanding between you and me. 
Thanks for coming here and giving the details. I’ve installed on brave browser and giving it a try 
Easy to get started with anon account. I may try an email account later, but so far just a couple of quick steps to get going.
Cheers.
Hi, welcome. Sorry for the hot welcome, I am sure these comments are not meant to be so brutal. This is a pleasant community , but there were some bad actors in the past as I am sure you have come across as well. I am delighted to see folk aligning to get the network out far and wide. It will take many more people and companies to get engaged.
The network is open source and for everybody, short, tall, closed, open, corporate, individuals and more. It cannot by design block anyone and by design it cannot police anyone. Anything close to that would be the death of the network and rightly so.
So forgive any perceived ill feelings or people telling you how to run your business. That is your decision and I am glad it involves autonomi, I hope you find the journey satisfying and easy. We need as much feedback as possibly in these early days and I appreciate any.
If you need anything I hope you will find help here, the folks are amazing and helpful.
It’s hard as hell to be public and under microscopic scrutiny at times, but I find it refreshing as sometimes we can all forget some detail that is actually important, even if it’s delivered in a very direct and accusatorial fashion. I still think the pain is worth it and it seems you do too. Hats off to anyone building these days, we need products in the decentralised world and we need them badly. So a well written nice GUI/UX is so much a necessity. Hats off to you for taking a plunge and well done for choosing a platform wisely.
What we have here is a truly decentralised network, i.e. no centralised data sources, no centralised networking components etc. We are aiming for the sky here and I hope yo find that valuable, especially in your security areas of business.
So no policing and no lecturing, tear away and love every minute of it!!
If your open source then all the better, I love that. But we all use proprietary stuff as well. It’s a marathon to freedom, not a sprint.
Hi and welcome to the forum. Its great to see open discussions from a partner with the community.
I wonder if you could indulge me with this. I was wondering how you see your product making use of Autonomi?
No need to be too detailed but an overview of the benefits you see Autonomi providing to the product.
Personally I do not see an issue with companies using Autonomi for data storage/apps not being open source as that will happen anyhow or even if some incentives are provided as this network is yet to be fully proven. My view is that the Autonomi team has to remain on the path for providing where possible the network it set out to implement and not change things to benefit one set of “partners” which in the end excludes others. In the end it is up to the users to decide whose products and/or apps they use.
Welcome to the forum and great to see a new partner! I look forward to seeing how you will work with autonomi in your apps.
Welcome !
If I understand correctly, you will use autonomi only for the passwordbreach data, not for storing the password data itself ? And will the clients talk to autonomi directly, or interface with your servers which talk to autonomi ?
It is very important that the incentives and the criteria by which they are provided are publicly announced, especially if it is public money, i.e. of the Foundation. Clearly, we all assume goodwill, so one can wait patiently for the details of the partnerships.
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