Yes lets be more Chinese than American about it - sorry @Josh ^
Emphasise the win-win aspects of co-operation rather than confrontation.
^ Perhaps more Xi than Biden would be better?
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Haha I don’t know much about Xi but if you mean win them over with kindness I agree.
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I wont crack the champagne open just yet ,but this is getting incredibly exciting now,
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@Southside means win them over with kindness of threatning and preparing occupation of neighbour countries, like China preparing occupationen of Taiwan inspired by Russia. Commies always lie and trying to manipulate because they are inferior and can’t make a impact in any other way.
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I try not to pick sides on world affairs (publicly), whilst I certainly have opinions the information those opinions are based on is questionable.
Anyway it’s divisive and not needed, here.
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I’d rather keep the flammable political provocation contained to the threads, where they usually are. No need to escalate them outside of those - as much as my opinion are aligned with yours @tobbetj.
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OK let me rephrase - and plagiarise @Josh
In the upcoming assault (who said the oft-anticipated and delayed counter-offensive?) on SAFE by the entrenched interests of the Blockchain Empire, we should endeavour to meet them with kindness and co-operation and stress the advantages of working together to a win-win situation.
Will that calm yese aw doon?
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Really is something this forum we just got @Southside to be politically polite 
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Iron fist in the velvet glove when it suits…
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Can anyone who runs a test network and can upload and download files let me know?
Once we have basic functions I’ll look at updating vdash hopefully in time for JoshNet.
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Uploading is fine - chunks are stored in a central location
~/.safe/node/chunks/ as opposed to ~/.safe/node/network_name/node_number/ that we are used to.
Downloading says its fine
willie@gagarin:~/.safe/node$ safe files download /fgfs/Scenery/Scotland/uploaded_files/
Loading file xornames from "file_names.txt" with length 17512
Downloading file 14fbbd(00010100)..
Successfully got file 14fbbd.. of 17480 bytes!
Downloading file 39bdae(00111001)..
Successfully got file 39bdae.. of 17480 bytes!
Downloading file 64db76(01100100)..
snip
Downloading file 45969a(01000101)..
Successfully got file 45969a.. of 8388736 bytes!
Downloading file 50840e(01010000)..
Successfully got file 50840e.. of 8388736 bytes!
Downloading file 758545(01110101)..
Successfully got file 758545.. of 8388736 bytes!
Downloading file 6f42c7(01101111)..
Successfully got file 6f42c7.. of 8388736 bytes!
Downloading file ae72c6(10101110)..
Successfully got file ae72c6.. of 8388736 bytes!
willie@gagarin:~/.safe/node$
So completes without error - small problem though - I can’t see just where these 4Gb of files are downloaded to…
Here is CPU and memory usage for ~4Gb of 8.3Mb .dds photo-scenery files uploaded and downloaded
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Look on the bright side - graphics cards might get cheaper. Or will they all get diverted to AI?
The planet will thank us - no matter your view on anthropomorphic global warming- ending the waste of all that energy on useless calculations can only be a GoodThing.
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Thank you for the heavy work team MaidSafe! I add the translations in the first post 
Privacy. Security. Freedom
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I reckon that AI will get specialized chips relatively soon. NVIDIA’s new tech for quickly creating UltraUV screens for chip manufacturing utilizing AI chip design is going to speed up the process of creating a wide range of specialized chips in the near future.
edit: thought I should reference that statement → link: Tech Wire Asia
I expect, that to get the bitcoiner’s onboard, we have to have a two-way bridge to move tokens on and off Safe - simply one way with burn isn’t going to attract them. But once they are on, they won’t really have much reason to leave. So the miners will continue so long as it’s profitable - could be for some time and will become more centralized and risk therein, may drive people to switch from bitcoin altogether and to adopt SNT.
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Very exciting to see all these new changes at play and being able to upload files again!
I forced nodes to go offline systematically by altering the duration in between a forceful safenode pid termination starting from 15 seconds → 30 seconds → 60 seconds → 120 seconds → 240 seconds, and observe what impact would be there on the safe files upload command (early termination?), and at what safenode total pid count levels would be at when an error was encountered.
Successfully stored file to ChunkAddress(d1b43c(11010001)..)
Storing file "ac66da72-4046-4933-8432-ee52908f8d5f.txt" of 10485760 bytes..
Successfully stored file to ChunkAddress(721174(01110010)..)
Storing file "2fdf7ca4-a0b4-46a7-bac1-0a91f534f4f2.txt" of 10485760 bytes..
Successfully stored file to ChunkAddress(32e7be(00110010)..)
Storing file "82a9793b-e2e3-429c-ad14-7b4d10b4ade3.txt" of 10485760 bytes..
...
04/22/2023 04:28:24 - Initial # of Safe Nodes: 35 - 15 Seconds:
04/22/2023 04:28:39 - Total Safe Node PIDs: 35; SAFE PID Killed: 16339 : SAFE CLI RUNNING
04/22/2023 04:28:54 - Total Safe Node PIDs: 34; SAFE PID Killed: 16346 : SAFE CLI RUNNING
04/22/2023 04:29:09 - Total Safe Node PIDs: 33; SAFE PID Killed: 16353 : SAFE CLI RUNNING
04/22/2023 04:29:24 - Total Safe Node PIDs: 32; SAFE PID Killed: 16360 : SAFE CLI TERMINATED
04/22/2023 04:23:39 - Initial # of Safe Nodes: 35 - 30 Seconds:
04/22/2023 04:24:09 - Total Safe Node PIDs: 35; SAFE PID Killed: 16033 : SAFE CLI RUNNING
04/22/2023 04:24:39 - Total Safe Node PIDs: 34; SAFE PID Killed: 16040 : SAFE CLI RUNNING
04/22/2023 04:25:09 - Total Safe Node PIDs: 33; SAFE PID Killed: 16050 : SAFE CLI RUNNING
04/22/2023 04:25:39 - Total Safe Node PIDs: 32; SAFE PID Killed: 16057 : SAFE CLI TERMINATED
04/22/2023 04:03:07 - Initial # of Safe Nodes: 35 - 60 Seconds:
04/22/2023 04:04:07 - Total Safe Node PIDs: 35; SAFE PID Killed: 15361 : SAFE CLI RUNNING
04/22/2023 04:05:07 - Total Safe Node PIDs: 34; SAFE PID Killed: 15368 : SAFE CLI RUNNING
04/22/2023 04:06:07 - Total Safe Node PIDs: 33; SAFE PID Killed: 15375 : SAFE CLI RUNNING
04/22/2023 04:07:07 - Total Safe Node PIDs: 32; SAFE PID Killed: 15382 : SAFE CLI RUNNING
04/22/2023 04:08:07 - Total Safe Node PIDs: 31; SAFE PID Killed: 15390 : SAFE CLI TERMINATED
04/22/2023 04:09:53 - Initial # of Safe Nodes: 35 - 120 Seconds:
04/22/2023 04:11:53 - Total Safe Node PIDs: 35; SAFE PID Killed: 15712 : SAFE CLI RUNNING
04/22/2023 04:13:53 - Total Safe Node PIDs: 34; SAFE PID Killed: 15719 : SAFE CLI RUNNING
04/22/2023 04:15:53 - Total Safe Node PIDs: 33; SAFE PID Killed: 15726 : SAFE CLI RUNNING
04/22/2023 04:17:53 - Total Safe Node PIDs: 32; SAFE PID Killed: 15733 : SAFE CLI RUNNING
04/22/2023 04:19:53 - Total Safe Node PIDs: 31; SAFE PID Killed: 15740 : SAFE CLI RUNNING
04/22/2023 04:21:53 - Total Safe Node PIDs: 30; SAFE PID Killed: 15748 : SAFE CLI TERMINATED
04/22/2023 04:47:21 - Initial # of Safe Nodes: 35 - 240 Seconds:
04/22/2023 04:51:21 - Total Safe Node PIDs: 35; SAFE PID Killed: 16955 : SAFE CLI RUNNING
04/22/2023 04:55:21 - Total Safe Node PIDs: 34; SAFE PID Killed: 16962 : SAFE CLI RUNNING
04/22/2023 04:59:21 - Total Safe Node PIDs: 33; SAFE PID Killed: 16969 : SAFE CLI RUNNING
04/22/2023 05:03:21 - Total Safe Node PIDs: 32; SAFE PID Killed: 16976 : SAFE CLI RUNNING
04/22/2023 05:07:22 - Total Safe Node PIDs: 31; SAFE PID Killed: 16983 : SAFE CLI TERMINATED
safe files upload terminated with the following in all the runs above (same stack trace outside of the guid.txt):
thread 'main' panicked at 'Did not store file "f588525d-d6a6-46b6-adcb-d75456ca289d.txt" to all nodes in the close group! Network Error Outbound Error.', safenode/src/bin/cli/files.rs:66:21
stack backtrace:
0: rust_begin_unwind
at /rustc/84c898d65adf2f39a5a98507f1fe0ce10a2b8dbc/library/std/src/panicking.rs:579:5
1: core::panicking::panic_fmt
at /rustc/84c898d65adf2f39a5a98507f1fe0ce10a2b8dbc/library/core/src/panicking.rs:64:14
2: safe::main::{{closure}}
3: tokio::runtime::park::CachedParkThread::block_on
4: tokio::runtime::scheduler::multi_thread::MultiThread::block_on
5: tokio::runtime::runtime::Runtime::block_on
6: safe::main
I didn’t carry out the tests dozens off times repeatedly and maybe the testing itself was flawed given all the changes being discussed lately with the cleaner and simpler network design, but overall the CPU, memory, and disk space were not maxed out on my local VM.
I am not sure what conclusions to draw from above, I was simply curious to see how the network would behave if random nodes were dropped either fast or slowly from a live local network… prior to the JoshNet testnet. I was hoping to see the safe files upload continuing to chug along as long as it can given the minimum network size and/or overall health criteria of the network was met. It seems if the duration between random nodes being killed was increased, the safe files upload continued to operate for a longer period, where as if the nodes were killed off faster, the safe files upload error’ed out earlier.
This all might be expected at this stage of development with a 35 node local testnet.
Overall, great weekly update team! Awesome to read all these latest changes, 
.
17 Likes
I think there will always be a use for Blockchains for some purposes. What we will have is better technology and much better for transfer of value and all the other things it can do that are unique but Blockchain is still a good technology. I know we are going to trust DBCs but there is still something valuable in the fact that that you can look through a blockchain and see that your entry is there and there are 50 blocks on top of it so it’s pretty much guaranteed there for all time. Slow and inefficient but some people will demand it for some purposes.
I think the existing Blockchains will continue to be used because of the momentum they have built up, the services that have been built on them and the inertia of moving them. As long as there is some value to be had by mining either financial or in terms of the preservation of information I think blocks will continue to be mined. Let’s not forget that Bitcoin did and can run with a much smaller number of nodes and a minute fraction of the hasing power it has now. It was only the ‘arms race’ caused by trying to mine blocks for financial benefit that has led to the obscene use of energy and chip resources it consumes.
Even if there becomes literally no financial or usage benefit to continuing to run Bitcoin nodes I’d bet a couple of SNT that they continue to be run by enthusiasts in the thousands. Like steam engines.
“What’s that big box in the corner grandpop?”
“That’s my old Bitcoin mining rig son. Still chugging away. I suppose I should just switch it off now that the last Bitcoin has been minted but I had some good times with it and made some good friends through it back in the day. Here, if you get your phone out I’ll transfer you a couple of Bitcoin via Safe.”
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I think bitcoin is here to stay but wonder what impact safe has on Ethereum?
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I think Safe Network storage will have a big impact on Blockchain because much of what Blockchains do can be done very much more efficiently on SN.
One aspect is storing the Blockchains themselves. There is no need for full nodes when a single copy on SN is available everywhere and can be verified by anyone.
The tricky bit will be how they get there - who owns that data, and how consensus for adding blocks is reached. But those should be solvable because anyone can verify the data. So multiple people could publish chains (without duplicating storage in SN) and anyone can spot a fork and check which is valid.
Another, bigger change might be to wrap Bitcoin as DBCs and trade those in SN. I wrote about that here in another topic. If you could trade bitcoin as SN DBCs or using traditional Blockchain transactions, which would you choose?
Pretty quickly a lot of trading would move to SN creating an avalanche effect at some tipping point, once creating blocks becomes unprofitable. The Blockchain would grind to a halt as remaining deposits are moved into DBCs and poof, bitcoin is solely on SN.
Both the above are speculative, back of the envelope ideas so it probably won’t be quite that simple, but maybe it will happen.
Either way, I hope it illustrates that SN is likely to have a big impact on existing crypto.
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That won’t happen in my opinion as long as there is no exchange on Safenet, nor smart contracts, nor bridges to blockchains. CommingSoon™? 
Yes, but that “arms race” was induced by an explosion of interest in crypto, which led to increase in price and transaction fees, so mining became more profitable.
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I wonder if Scrypto which is based on Rust could be ported to SN for smart contracts.
The asset-oriented programming language for DeFi
Scrypto is the open source smart contract language of the Radix public network. Scrypto rethinks how smart contracts are built to finally let developers create secure and powerful DeFi dApps (decentralized apps) that users can rely on – spending most of their time and code on functionality, not worrying about losing money.
Scrypto is asset-oriented, meaning that Scrypto is the first language where assets of value (whether tokens, NFTs, and more) are first-class types that ensure nothing is lost or unaccounted for at runtime. Developers can confidently focus on writing core dApp logic that is safer because they never have to implement asset behavior and error-checking themselves – eliminating risk and complexity at the same time.
Scrypto is based on Rust , providing the powerful and expressive logic of one of the best-loved languages today, while adding asset-oriented primitives and functions that let the developer focus on quickly programming finance, not programming a blockchain.
13 Likes