Anyone remember localbitcoin, it is still running and provides a lot of people an easy way to buy BTC without the need to learn all about DEXes or defi or other things.
I agree with @JimCollinson that we should just go with native safecoin and build systems around it (as needed)
exchanges will integrate it real easy, easier than omni
a localsafecoin market place will open up
Simplier for new people since they can do as @JimCollinson showed and on a single screen purchase from exchanges safecoin with a card of some sort.
One Step process that requires no learning of proxy tokens or DEXes
Native means there are not people doing trading to/from proxy and since they are profiting then its obvious they are sucking value out of the coin for new people and raise the cost of entry while the network is young
And the biggest issue I can see by going the proxy coin route is that the systems and work flow will be built around that. This means there is less resources and effort going into developing native work flows and systems for transacting native safecoin.
safecoin gift cards are so easy with native safecoin but they would not be developed if the effort has gone into developing erc20 proxy systems
And I can guarantee there will be 1000’s to 10s of thousands of support questions/complaints/tickets for people who get the proxy safecoin and are angry that the network will not upload for them. It will confuse many new people and they will not get their head around that they then need to exchange the proxy for actual safecoin. They will not know how to link their proxy safecoin to their account. Not to mention all the new people who look at the work flow for proxy to safecoin and just stop because they were just going to try out this new network and put SAFE into the too hard basket
SAFEcoin is designed to work native and that is the simplest for adoption
It was not manipulation in my mind.
That is how the system is designed to work.
Why i used the word inelegant.
Almost as though the system was designed so someone could watch incoming orders and profiteer from it.
But it works, so was not broken.
I have made my arguments, I think I will leave it at that. If you can convince some of the smart wizards on this forum that liquidity pools are a good thing then good job.
If someone wants they can google defi liquidity pool attacks or problems.
I think you misunderstood what I meant
But I will leave it at that.
I think you are missing something here, and that is the accessability of farming for Safecoin, vs. bitcoin/Ethereum. Mining is just completely inaccessible and fruitless for individuals now—the only miner are big miners, whereas that shouldn’t be the case for farming. It opens things back up to the individual.
Farming is a great option to get Safecoin without any KYC, or any 3rd party involved whatsoever. It’s a great option for those really concerned about this.
What are the options for buying BTC/ETH without KYC at the moment?
When it comes to selling or otherwise trading Safecoin, we really should just be pursuing native integration with exchanges, there needed not be any bounce via another currency for this to happen, which is more expensive and time consuming for the end user, and less profitable for the exchange to boot.
I agree there will be non KYC methods and if @Antifragile is correct that the will be many users, but they’ll only want a few dollars worth of coins, this could help.
It makes one to one trading easier and low risk, so we should expect that like the early days of bitcoin people will meet up in cafes etc to buy and sell small amounts.
If there’s demand, generally the methods follow unless there’s suppression through enforcement, and I don’t see how this can be stopped. I also doubt that it will be seen as a big enough problem for authorities to worry about until it’s far too late.
Yeah, I didn’t touch on this, but we’re going out of our way to make this as simple, and fast as possible.
There shouldn’t be the learning curve that was associated to bitcoin either. If someone can use something like paypal, then they should be confident enough for Safecoin too. The same cannot be said for existing crypto, and especially ETH.
This could be an opportunity for the community marketeers - I can imagine some great viral takes on this slightly subversive new thing. Might appeal to a lot of people who are fed up one way or another with how existing money works, how hard it is to earn, how controlled, etc.
BTW, this wasn’t a rhetorical question. We are building this network not as another crypto project, but as a platform available to anyone, especially those currently disenfranchised. So it should be accessible even if you have not used a crypto currency before.
But say I do hold some ETH, can you describe to me what you’re imagining the workflow being, from say a paper ETH wallet, through to having my file uploaded on the Safe network? What do you imagine?
And what is wrong with the person to person purchase of a few dollars of safecoin?
Just like a localsafecoin app where people can barter. Gifting a few dollars via paypal is not wrong by their terms. Meeting some and exchange a fiver for some safecoin is going to happen a lot
This is the big redundant step though, right. You can do this all in a decentralised way, with native integration between the exchange and the Safecoin. It’s less work than creating the ETH > ERC20 > Safecoin process that you describe.
This is the process we should be pursuing in the first instance, and there will be time to do it. The process could be proven on top of the testnets, and ready to roll when we go live, if we focus on it.
Now a person could let it be known they are wanting to sell safecoin in lots of 10$ or less to anyone who wants to buy. Payment by paypal say and transfer the correct amount of safecoin to them
They could “advertise” via say a forum, or a SAFEnetwork app, in newspaper, etc etc. There are many places that allow free advertising for tokens or giftcards (which is what safecoin would fall under) and people can rate the person.
This happened for BTC and a localbitcoins site grew and 10’s of thousands of people got their first btc from there.
This would allow face to face or paypal or even btc as payment methods without kyc and since very small amounts its is under any reporting requirements for most countries. (Also assuming total sales before some 5 or 10 thousand threshold specified by relative tax for non-business hobby)
There are a lot of ways for people to buy their initial safecoin to get going.
Including, of course, the invite system we have devised, allowing folk to help others onboard with as little friction as possible; give someone an invite (either gratis, or sold to them) and they have all they need to get going. Further iterations of this will allow for you to add additional funds to the invite too.
Not to mention Paypals insane tax on sales, a less barbaric way to buy Safecoin already exists. Certainly some kind of Syscoin like kind of bridge would be built into the existing system or perhaps an app/wallet like Dether has with a in built swap feature. Getting listed on some BTC ATMS couldn’t hurt either.
I only used paypal as an example of a payment method. But of course there are other money payment methods available. You can be local and use bank payments. In AU we have instant bank account to bank account transfers for quite a while now.
The point is that for small amounts there are many ways to transact and no reason locally cannot work great to fill that kyc hole with small amounts that are under the reporting amounts anyhow.